Close All Tabs

What happens when your therapist is… a chatbot?

For KQED health reporter Lesley McClurg, it started with a late-night spiral over dating. Instead of texting a friend, she opened ChatGPT and got the kind of calm, reassuring advice she needed. It worked… maybe a little too well.

Lesley joins Morgan to dig into the rise of AI therapy, why so many people are turning to chatbots for emotional support, and what they might be risking in the process. These systems promise something traditional mental health care often can’t: instant, affordable, judgment-free access. But there are limits and, sometimes, serious consequences. 

Note: This episode includes discussions of suicide and mental health conditions. Listener discretion is advised.

This episode first aired on April 23rd, 2025 

Guest: 

Lesley McClurg, KQED health correspondent

Further Reading/Listening:

Can AI Replace Your Therapist? The Benefits, Risks and Unsettling Truths - Lesley McClurg, KQED

The AI therapist can see you now - Katia Riddle, NPR 

Woebot, a Mental-Health Chatbot, Tries Out Generative AI - Casey Sackett, Devin Harper, and Aaron Pavez, IEEE Spectrum

AI Prophets and Spiritual Delusions — Close All Tabs 

New Studies Reveal Mental Health Blindspots of AI Chatbots — Marlynn Wei, Psychology Today AI in the mental health care workforce is met with fear, pushback — and enthusiasm — Rhitu Chatterjee, NPR 

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Credits: Close All Tabs is hosted by Morgan Sung. Our team includes producer Maya Cueva, editor Chris Hambrick and senior editor Chris Egusa who also composed our theme song and credits music. Additional music from APM. Audio engineering by Brendan Willard. Audience engagement support from Maha Sanad. Jen Chien is our Director of Podcasts. Ethan Toven-Lindsey is our Editor in Chief.
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In 2018, researcher Eva Galperin made a discovery about a colleague. He had been sexually abusing women for decades, and threatening to expose their private information using “stalkerware” — hidden applications that allow people to spy on another person’s private life through their mobile device. This set Eva on a new path. She went on to found the Coalition Against Stalkerware, a network of researchers and advocacy groups working to limit the spread of stalkerware and support survivors of tech-enabled abuse. 

Eva joins Morgan to talk about how her background in cybersecurity allowed her to help countless survivors of stalkerware abuse, and how activists and researchers are beginning to turn the tide against a sprawling, largely hidden industry.

Guest: 

Eva Galperin, director of cybersecurity at the Electronic Frontier Foundation

Further Reading/Listening:

What is stalkerware? — Coalition Against Stalkerware 

Hacked, leaked, exposed: Why you should never use stalkerware apps — Lorenzo Franceschi-Bicchierai, TechCrunch 

When whisper networks let us down — Sarah Jeong, The Verge

Spyware Company Leaves ‘Terabytes’ of Selfies, Text Messages, and Location Data Exposed Online — Lorenzo Franceschi-Bicchierai, Vice 

A massive 'stalkerware' leak puts the phone data of thousands at risk  — Zack Whittaker, TechCrunch 

Support King, banned by FTC, linked to new phone spying operation — Zack Whittaker, TechCrunch 

EFF Teams Up With AV Comparatives to Test Android Stalkerware Detection by Major Antivirus Apps — Eva Galperin, Electronic Frontier Foundation

Read the Transcript here

Email us at [email protected]

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Credits: Close All Tabs is hosted by Morgan Sung. Our team includes producer Maya Cueva, editor Chris Hambrick and senior editor Chris Egusa who also composed our theme song and credits music. Additional music from APM. Audio engineering by Brendan Willard and Brian Douglass. Audience engagement support from Maha Sanad. Jen Chien is our Director of Podcasts. Ethan Toven-Lindsey is our Editor in Chief.
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Life on an H-1B visa — a visa that lets U.S. companies hire foreign-born workers for specialized jobs — is difficult, unpredictable, and has gotten even harder under the Trump administration. A new gaming studio, Reality Reload, is trying to capture that experience in a mobile game. It’s called H1B.Life, and it simulates the difficult choices, competing priorities, and personal sacrifices visa holders face — complete with chaotic design elements, like all-powerful “gods” who control your fate.

KQED reporter Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman joins Morgan to break down the game’s surprising design choices, the mission behind it, and the stories he heard from people navigating the H1-B process.

Guest: Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman, reporter at KQED

Further Reading/Listening:

What Does It Take to Get a H-1B Visa? This Video Game Shows Just How Complicated It Is — Azul Dahlstrom-Eckman, KQED

Meta, Google, and Amazon slash H-1B petitions after Trump's visa crackdown — Geoff Weiss, Melia Russell, Andy Kiersz, and Alex Nicoll, Business Insider 

Faculty Warn Against State Bans on H-1B Visas — Jessica Blake, Inside Higher Ed 

H-1B Visa Restrictions Will Hurt America’s Research Potential, Experts Say — Shelby Bradford, PhD, The Scientist 

US Tech Visa Applications Are Being Put Through the Wringer — Lauren Goode, Wired 

A New Game Turns the H-1B Visa System Into a Surreal Simulation — Zeyi Yang, Wired 

Read the Transcript here

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Credits: Close All Tabs is hosted by Morgan Sung. Our team includes producer Maya Cueva, editor Chris Hambrick and senior editor Chris Egusa who also composed our theme song and credits music. Additional music from APM. Audio engineering by Brendan Willard. Audience engagement support from Maha Sanad. Jen Chien is our Director of Podcasts. Ethan Toven-Lindsey is our Editor in Chief.
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In a spring installment of Save or Scroll, Morgan teams up with culture journalist Steffi Cao to dig into the stories they can’t stop thinking about. From looksmaxxing to AI Fruit Love Island, BTS’ new album, and Meta losing a landmark series of lawsuits, they’ve got a lot to discuss.

Save or Scroll is our series where we team up with guests for a rapid-fire roundup of internet trends that are filling our feeds right now. At the end of each segment, they’ll decide: is the post just for the group chat, or should we save it for a future episode?

Guest:

Steffi Cao, culture journalist 

Further Reading/Listening:

More from Steffi Cao — Substack

Inside Clavicular’s Thirsty Tour of New York City — Kieran Press-Reynolds, GQ

Why Steroids Are Now Turning Young Men into Dangerous Incels — Steffi Cao, The Daily Beast  

‘Fruit Love Island’ is TikTok’s most popular AI-generated series. It’s now facing trouble in paradise — Jude Cramer, Fast Company 

There’s Something Very Dark About a Lot of Those Viral AI Fruit Videos — Kat Tenbarge, Wired 

Who Decides If BTS’s Album ‘Arirang’ is ‘Korean Enough’? — Jiye Kim, Teen Vogue 

BTS’s Arirang comeback was supposed to be a triumph. What happened? — Nadira Goffe, Slate 

Meta and YouTube ordered to pay $3 million to young woman in social media addiction trial — Jasmine Mithani, The 19th

What the Verdict Against Meta and Google Says About the Way We Live Now — Jeannie Suk Gersen, The New Yorker 

The Truth About the Social Media Addiction Trial — Taylor Lorenz, Free Speech Friday  

Read the Transcript here

Email us at [email protected]

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⁠Credits: Close All Tabs is hosted by Morgan Sung. Our team includes producer Maya Cueva, editor Chris Hambrick and senior editor Chris Egusa who also composed our theme song and credits music. Additional music from APM. Audio engineering by Brendan Willard. Audience engagement support from Maha Sanad. Jen Chien is our Director of Podcasts. Ethan Toven-Lindsey is our Editor in Chief.
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Only 2% of Americans identify as members of the Church of Latter-day Saints — and yet a striking number of American social media influencers are Mormon. Why? The answer lies in a mix of religious doctrine, early internet adoption, and some surprising financial incentives.

In this episode, author and journalist Fortesa Latifi returns to the show to unpack her research for her new book, Like, Follow, Subscribe: Influencer Kids and the Cost of a Childhood Online. She breaks down the hidden industry behind Mormon “momfluencers,” how these creators both uphold and push against a patriarchal system, and why the trad wife fantasy can be damaging far beyond their audience. Plus, she and Morgan tackle the question hanging over reality TV fans everywhere: “Will MomTok survive this?”

Guest:

Fortesa Latifi, journalist and author of Like, Follow, Subscribe: Influencer Kids and the Cost of a Childhood Online.

Further Reading/Listening:

Like, Follow, Subscribe: Influencer Kids and the Cost of a Childhood Online — Fortesa Latifi, Simon & Schuster 

the Mormon Church pays its influencers — Fortesa Latifi, What’s The Vibe

A Refresher on the Mormon MomTok Drama — Danielle Cohen, Olivia Truffaut-Wong, and Julia Reinstein, The Cut 

'The Bachelorette' Cast Taylor Frankie Paul For The Mess. They Got It. So, Who's To Blame?  — Katherine Singh, Refinery 29 

'The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives' Shows the Trad Wife Reality  — Quinci LeGardye, Marie Claire 

Does the LDS Church pay influencers? Well, actually, yes. — Dylan Eubank, The Salt Lake Tribune

Meet the queen of the ‘trad wives’ (and her eight children) — Megan Agnew, The Times Tradwife life isn't as good as it looks on TikTok — just ask former tradwives — Isabella Gomez Sarmiento, NPR

Read the Transcript ⁠here⁠

Email us at ⁠[email protected]⁠

Follow us on⁠ Instagram⁠⁠ and⁠ ⁠TikTok⁠⁠

Credits: Close All Tabs is hosted by Morgan Sung. Our team includes producer Maya Cueva, editor Chris Hambrick and senior editor Chris Egusa who also composed our theme song and credits music. Additional music from APM. Audio engineering by Brendan Willard. Audience engagement support from Maha Sanad. Jen Chien is our Director of Podcasts. Ethan Toven-Lindsey is our Editor in Chief.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices