The Art of Manliness

The ancient Greeks believed the human soul had three parts: reason, appetite, and something called thumos. Thumos is difficult to translate into English. It encompasses anger, noble spiritedness, pride, ambition, a sense of honor, and the drive to act. The Greeks thought it was essential to living a life of manly virtue, and my guest thinks we could use a lot more of it.
His name is Mike LeBlanc, and he’s a decorated Marine, a Harvard Business School grad, a tech founder, and the author of What If Anger Is the Answer? Today on the show, Mike and I discuss how the angry energy of thumos can help you close the gap between who you are and who you should be. We discuss why physical training helps cultivate thumos, how it can be an aid in overcoming appetites, overthinking, passivity, and cynicism, and the role it can play in being an effective leader.

Resources Related to the Podcast
AoM Article: Got Thumos?
AoM Article: 10 Movies That Inspire Thumos
AoM Article: Soundtrack for Your Thumos
AoM Article: How to Make Anger Your Ally
AoM Podcast #1,083: Good Anger — Harnessing a Misunderstood Emotion
AoM Series: The Life of Jack London as a Case Study in the Power and Perils of Thumos
Connect With Mike LeBlanc
Mike's website
Mike on LinkedIn

0:00 Introduction
1:42 Meet Mike LeBlanc: Marines, Great Books & Robotics
5:45 A Letter to His Son: What It Means to Be a Man
8:07 Socrates' Metaphor: The Little Man, the Hydra & the Lion
15:26 The Attributes of Thumos: Dignity, Pride & Shame
17:36 Thumos and Action: The Soul's Three Parts at Work
20:19 Thumos in Defending Boundaries
25:31 Thumos and the Physical Body
31:36 Thumos vs. Overthinking: The 70% Solution
36:03 Thumos, Power & Authority in Leadership
44:42 Overcoming Cynicism with Thumos
49:46 Raising Boys with Thumos & Where to Find the Book

See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Note: This is a rebroadcast.
Have you ever known one of those people who seemed to be able to connect with anyone? The kind of person who had the ability to make others feel understood and smoothly navigate even the trickiest of conversations?
Charles Duhigg calls these folks “supercommunicators,” and he’s the author of a new book by the same name. Today on the show, Charles explains that what underlies supercommunicators’ skill in connection is something called the matching principle, and he unpacks how it works and how you can put it to use in your own conversations. We discuss several techniques for how to figure out what kind of conversation you’re having, so you can align your language and energy with the other person. And because emotional conversations can be particularly difficult, we dig into tactics for successfully navigating them, even when they contain a high degree of conflict. We also get into how to carry the skills of connection into your digital conversations.
Resources Related to the Podcast
Charles’ previous appearances on the AoM podcast:
Episode #61: The Power of Habit
Episode #196: The Science of Self-Motivation & Productivity
AoM Podcast #559: How to Handle Difficult Conversations

Connect With Charles Duhigg
Charles’ website

0:00 — Intro & Rebroadcast Notice
0:32 — Why Communication Matters
2:08 — The Matching Principle
5:07 — Deep Questions & FBI Negotiator Felix Sigala
9:50 — Identifying What Kind of Conversation You're Having
10:52 — Setting Goals & Preparing for Conversations
15:06 — Conversations as Quiet Negotiations
19:07 — Navigating Emotional Conversations
24:11 — Turning Shallow Questions Into Deep Questions
28:00 — Mood, Energy & NASA's Emotional Intelligence Test
32:34 — Looping for Understanding & High-Conflict Conversations
38:38 — Digital Communication & Closing

See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Remember the old hotel ice machines? The kind where you'd slide your bucket under the chute and hear the avalanche of cubes crashing into it? There was something so fun and strangely gratifying about that thing.
Or think about breaking an icicle off the edge of a roof. Such a gratifying feeling from such a small act.
My guest has written an ode to the outsized pleasures that arise from these kinds of everyday interactions with the physical world. His name is Ian Bogost, and his new book is The Small Stuff. Today on the show, Ian argues that a fulfilling life isn't built solely by chasing the big components of happiness but also by embracing the small moments of gratification that are woven throughout ordinary life. We discuss how those moments can be found in tactile experiences like shifting a manual transmission, turning a well-made knob, or flipping through the pages of a real menu. We explore how these small opportunities for engagement — for contact, connection, and control— have been disappearing as the world becomes more digitized and automated and everything becomes a touchscreen. And Ian shares how opportunities for "sensory enchantment" can still be found in our increasingly dematerialized world.

Resources Related to the Podcast
Ian's previous appearance on the AoM Podcast: Episode #247 — The Pleasure of Limits, the Uses of Boredom, and the Antidote to Excessive Irony
Ian's Atlantic article "The End of Manual Transmission"
Andy Rooney compilation
Connect With Ian Bogost
The Small Stuff website
Ian's website
Ian's faculty page

0:00 Introduction
0:40 Ian Bogost and 'The Small Stuff'
2:25 What Kickstarted This Book
6:38 Happiness, Satisfaction, and Gratification
14:58 Gratification Is Everywhere — But Disappearing
18:28 Dematerialization: How the World Is Losing Sensory Richness
26:41 How Work Has Become Less Gratifying
33:09 How to Reclaim Your Sensory Life
38:35 Keep More Junk Around
44:38 Talk About Small Pleasures
48:17 Living Life Sideways (Orthogonality)
50:03 Wrap-Up
See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

People are told their whole lives how important it is to find their purpose. But many find the search frustrating. They feel there's one true calling or one grand goal they're supposed to be pursuing, but they can't seem to discern what it is.
My guest, Jordan Grumet, author of The Purpose Code, says that searching for what he calls your big P purpose can be fruitless and even harmful, and that a better path is to embrace a life of little p purposes. Today on the show, Jordan explains the difference between big P and little p purposes and argues that the former can lead to anxiety while embracing the latter can be the path to meaning, satisfaction, connection, and even the legacy you were looking for in the first place. We discuss how Jordan found his way to this philosophy after burning out as a doctor, practical ways to discover your own little p purposes, what he thinks we get wrong in making family our purpose, and what his work in hospice has taught him about living a life without regret.

Connect With Jordan Grumet
Jordan's website
Jordan's Substack: The Purpose Code

00:00 Intro & Show Overview
0:41 Meet Jordan Grumet
1:46 From Doctor to Purpose Writer
5:00 Big P vs Little P Purpose
8:32 Why Purpose Talk Makes People Anxious
11:15 What the Research Says
13:42 Burnout and Big P Purpose
16:18 The Podcasting Example: Process vs Goals
19:42 Legacy Through Little P Purpose
28:24 Finding Your Purpose Anchors
38:01 The Climb: Building Your Purpose
43:14 Family, Regrets, and Final Thoughts
See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

With the release of Christopher Nolan's adaptation of the Odyssey, it seems like everyone's been talking about a 3,000-year-old epic again. But my guest thinks this ancient tale offers a framework for understanding our modern lives that you probably haven't heard before.
Patrick Deneen is a professor of political science and the author of American Odyssey. Today on the show, Patrick argues that Odysseus embodies a tension that has defined the human experience, and especially the American experience: we're both home-seeking and exploring, rooted and restless. We long to settle down somewhere, yet we're equally driven to push beyond the horizon in search of something new. Patrick shares how Alexis de Tocqueville made this observation about our country two centuries ago, how Odysseus navigates the temptation to become both more than human and less than human, and the surprising act Patrick thinks is the most heroic thing Odysseus does. We end our conversation with the idea that having a home can give us the confidence to explore, or as David Brooks put it, "All of life is a series of daring explorations from a secure base."

Resources Related to the Podcast
AoM Article: 3 Lessons From Homer’s Odyssey
AoM Podcast #337: What Homer’s Odyssey Can Teach Us Today
Democracy in America by Alexis de Tocqueville
"Ulysses" by Alfred, Lord Tennyson
Connect With Patrick Deneen
Patrick's faculty page
Patrick's website
American Odyssey's page on Creed and Culture's website

0:00 Intro & sponsor plugs
0:41 Patrick Deneen's American Odyssey & Nolan's film
2:28 Nolan's changes to Odysseus's character
4:56 Dante's Odysseus in hell
7:33 Why Odyssey keeps drawing Patrick back
13:02 The most American text: home-seeking vs exploring
17:15 Tocqueville's restless Americans
20:03 Restlessness as source of American unhappiness
21:03 Odysseus vs the temptation to be more/less than human
26:14 That temptation in modern American life
31:26 Odysseus's underworld talk with Achilles
39:41 What today's Americans can take from that
41:24 Does Odysseus stay home? The "sequels" to The Odyssey
45:49 Home as the foundation for risk-taking and adventure
51:14 Where to find the book
See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.