The Stormers have the best defence in the URC this season. Fewer than 2.7 tries conceded per game, dominant entry denial into the 22, and a jackal game that suffocates teams before they build momentum. But Norman Laker will be the first to tell you the last three games leaked 15 tries, and Cardiff found the edge.In this Side-by-Side, Harry Jones sits down with Stormers wing Seabelo Senatla and defence coach Norman Laker, literally shoulder to shoulder, for a conversation that goes well beyond tactics. They talk about what 4G pitches actually do to a defensive line, why chaos is not the opposite of structure, how a ten-year relationship between a coach and a player changes what is possible on the field, and what the right emotional register looks like heading into a home quarterfinal against the team that just beat you.Norman is honest and slightly unhinged in the best possible way. Seabelo is thoughtful, precise, and clearly enjoying every second of this stage of his career. Together they are one of the most interesting pairings this Stormers series have produced.On this episode of Lekker Rugby Pod, MW Welman and Harry Jones go side by side with two of the key figures behind the Stormers' defence ahead of the Cardiff quarterfinal.